1 00:00:20,350 --> 00:00:17,220 [Music] 2 00:00:23,620 --> 00:00:20,360 how's it going ladies and gentlemen my 3 00:00:26,820 --> 00:00:23,630 name is MJ ben iose I'm very happy to be 4 00:00:30,610 --> 00:00:26,830 here with you today for this sweet 5 00:00:33,220 --> 00:00:30,620 online UFO conference that's happening I 6 00:00:34,780 --> 00:00:33,230 mean how great is that I hope you're all 7 00:00:38,350 --> 00:00:34,790 taking care of yourself I hope you're 8 00:00:41,220 --> 00:00:38,360 all you know staying safe staying away 9 00:00:43,810 --> 00:00:41,230 from each other following kind of the 10 00:00:46,090 --> 00:00:43,820 CDC's guidelines on social distancing 11 00:00:48,340 --> 00:00:46,100 this is obviously one of those weird 12 00:00:51,160 --> 00:00:48,350 times in history I'm sure we'll all 13 00:00:54,670 --> 00:00:51,170 laugh about and cry about at the same 14 00:00:58,360 --> 00:00:54,680 time I'm at the cabin as you can see I'm 15 00:01:00,729 --> 00:00:58,370 in the woods here Jason McClellan asked 16 00:01:04,060 --> 00:01:00,739 me to shoot a video for you guys in 17 00:01:05,800 --> 00:01:04,070 regards to UFOs and I was like what 18 00:01:09,100 --> 00:01:05,810 better place to do it than out here in 19 00:01:14,310 --> 00:01:09,110 the wilderness and so you know I want to 20 00:01:15,540 --> 00:01:14,320 talk today about UFOs as this 21 00:01:18,160 --> 00:01:15,550 countercultural 22 00:01:19,660 --> 00:01:18,170 idea that's really where my focus is 23 00:01:22,510 --> 00:01:19,670 when it comes to UFOs you know I am 24 00:01:24,310 --> 00:01:22,520 interested in what UFOs are as objects 25 00:01:25,660 --> 00:01:24,320 and you know who's behind them or 26 00:01:27,520 --> 00:01:25,670 whatever but I really think you know 27 00:01:29,560 --> 00:01:27,530 unfortunately this time I think that 28 00:01:31,090 --> 00:01:29,570 that's kind of the wrong questions and 29 00:01:33,300 --> 00:01:31,100 the wrong answers where we're trying to 30 00:01:37,570 --> 00:01:33,310 kind of get to I'm trying to figure out 31 00:01:39,640 --> 00:01:37,580 who's behind UFOs what UFOs are you know 32 00:01:42,990 --> 00:01:39,650 whether they're technology or whether 33 00:01:45,550 --> 00:01:43,000 they're some sort of mystical divine 34 00:01:47,250 --> 00:01:45,560 concept that exists with humans or 35 00:01:49,270 --> 00:01:47,260 whatever who knows right I mean this is 36 00:01:50,980 --> 00:01:49,280 speculation at best we unfortunately 37 00:01:54,510 --> 00:01:50,990 don't have enough evidence for any of 38 00:01:56,770 --> 00:01:54,520 this so what can we actually look at and 39 00:01:59,050 --> 00:01:56,780 this is kind of the part that you know 40 00:02:01,270 --> 00:01:59,060 generally for a lot of people pisses 41 00:02:05,620 --> 00:02:01,280 them off right there there is no real 42 00:02:08,229 --> 00:02:05,630 answer to the UFO kind of enigma yet so 43 00:02:11,770 --> 00:02:08,239 what can we look at fundamentally it's 44 00:02:14,949 --> 00:02:11,780 the people it's the culture that creates 45 00:02:18,640 --> 00:02:14,959 UFOs it's the culture that deals with 46 00:02:20,680 --> 00:02:18,650 UFOs it's the social frameworks and the 47 00:02:22,990 --> 00:02:20,690 the media and the value systems that 48 00:02:26,050 --> 00:02:23,000 kind of exist in our world every day 49 00:02:27,550 --> 00:02:26,060 that kind of generate the UFO reality so 50 00:02:30,899 --> 00:02:27,560 that's what I want to talk about today I 51 00:02:34,030 --> 00:02:30,909 want to talk about UFOs as really a 52 00:02:36,569 --> 00:02:34,040 countercultural movement and and the UFO 53 00:02:39,339 --> 00:02:36,579 discourse is a sort of countercultural 54 00:02:42,309 --> 00:02:39,349 conversation we're all having so what we 55 00:02:44,789 --> 00:02:42,319 need to do is really we need to kind of 56 00:02:49,530 --> 00:02:44,799 first really look at what we mean here 57 00:02:53,170 --> 00:02:49,540 on one hand right on the objective end 58 00:02:55,929 --> 00:02:53,180 we have human observation right we have 59 00:02:58,059 --> 00:02:55,939 individuals who see UFOs we have 60 00:03:00,849 --> 00:02:58,069 individuals who encounter anomalous 61 00:03:02,589 --> 00:03:00,859 phenomena whether it's flying saucers 62 00:03:05,199 --> 00:03:02,599 whether it's orbs or lights in the sky 63 00:03:07,390 --> 00:03:05,209 whether it's angelic beings whether it's 64 00:03:11,199 --> 00:03:07,400 Mothman who knows man we have these 65 00:03:14,500 --> 00:03:11,209 cases these observable moments right 66 00:03:15,819 --> 00:03:14,510 that you know happen sure you're always 67 00:03:17,170 --> 00:03:15,829 gonna have your percentage that's gonna 68 00:03:18,699 --> 00:03:17,180 be delusion and you're always can have 69 00:03:23,470 --> 00:03:18,709 your percentage that's gonna be hoaxes 70 00:03:25,360 --> 00:03:23,480 and and your kind of null cases but you 71 00:03:29,670 --> 00:03:25,370 also gonna have of all of that 72 00:03:32,440 --> 00:03:29,680 a collection of cases that are you know 73 00:03:35,289 --> 00:03:32,450 genuine at least to a point so we have 74 00:03:38,259 --> 00:03:35,299 some sort of objective idea happening 75 00:03:40,899 --> 00:03:38,269 here some sort of objective concept that 76 00:03:43,599 --> 00:03:40,909 is being created or or at least 77 00:03:47,759 --> 00:03:43,609 manifesting in some way you have human 78 00:03:50,860 --> 00:03:47,769 experience and human observation that is 79 00:03:52,509 --> 00:03:50,870 recordable at least historically but on 80 00:03:55,420 --> 00:03:52,519 the flip side of that right the flip 81 00:03:57,550 --> 00:03:55,430 side of this weird UFO reality is is 82 00:04:01,599 --> 00:03:57,560 obviously kind of the more subjective 83 00:04:05,250 --> 00:04:01,609 angle the cultural milieu of in which 84 00:04:09,580 --> 00:04:05,260 these UFOs appear the media social 85 00:04:11,679 --> 00:04:09,590 values religious values all of these 86 00:04:14,140 --> 00:04:11,689 social constructs that exist around us 87 00:04:17,050 --> 00:04:14,150 these paradigms of society that really 88 00:04:19,860 --> 00:04:17,060 also govern you the UFO discourse to 89 00:04:22,300 --> 00:04:19,870 suggest that UFOs aren't affected by 90 00:04:25,390 --> 00:04:22,310 media interpretation and then therefore 91 00:04:27,040 --> 00:04:25,400 our interpretation is ridiculous it's 92 00:04:30,700 --> 00:04:27,050 undefensible obviously that's what's 93 00:04:32,860 --> 00:04:30,710 going on so we need to kind of juxtapose 94 00:04:35,230 --> 00:04:32,870 these two ideas right on top of the 95 00:04:35,570 --> 00:04:35,240 media and on top of politics and on top 96 00:04:38,029 --> 00:04:35,580 of 97 00:04:39,950 --> 00:04:38,039 street you also have literally like like 98 00:04:43,070 --> 00:04:39,960 a whole culture of lunacy right you have 99 00:04:45,499 --> 00:04:43,080 UFO cults you have conspiracy theories 100 00:04:47,300 --> 00:04:45,509 dictating that there's dead bodies and 101 00:04:49,129 --> 00:04:47,310 some underground bunker somewhere you 102 00:04:51,890 --> 00:04:49,139 have all of these also other ridiculous 103 00:04:54,020 --> 00:04:51,900 claims that exists within UFO discourse 104 00:04:56,749 --> 00:04:54,030 that also add to this kind of more 105 00:04:59,540 --> 00:04:56,759 social cultural interpretation of what 106 00:05:03,409 --> 00:04:59,550 UFOs are so really fundamentally these 107 00:05:07,070 --> 00:05:03,419 two sides this kind of objective human 108 00:05:10,580 --> 00:05:07,080 experience the objective act of seeing 109 00:05:13,640 --> 00:05:10,590 something that is anomalous and then the 110 00:05:17,749 --> 00:05:13,650 other side right the media the culture 111 00:05:20,390 --> 00:05:17,759 the society cults spear see theorists 112 00:05:24,320 --> 00:05:20,400 all that nonsense that that also kind of 113 00:05:28,100 --> 00:05:24,330 exists and these two kind of commingle 114 00:05:29,839 --> 00:05:28,110 and create ufology or create UFO 115 00:05:31,369 --> 00:05:29,849 discourse you know and the question 116 00:05:33,559 --> 00:05:31,379 becomes well how do we make progress in 117 00:05:36,980 --> 00:05:33,569 in the study of UFOs how does a a 118 00:05:39,950 --> 00:05:36,990 ufologist quote-unquote go out and and 119 00:05:43,790 --> 00:05:39,960 make progress in the study in the ology 120 00:05:45,920 --> 00:05:43,800 of ufos and this is the part that pisses 121 00:05:48,260 --> 00:05:45,930 us off right because ultimately what 122 00:05:51,320 --> 00:05:48,270 kind of stuck we're stuck in this 123 00:05:53,420 --> 00:05:51,330 dualistic realm between worlds right or 124 00:05:56,779 --> 00:05:53,430 stuck in this this idea that okay 125 00:05:59,809 --> 00:05:56,789 something objective is going on but that 126 00:06:02,089 --> 00:05:59,819 objective thing is being governed and 127 00:06:04,430 --> 00:06:02,099 filtered through this kind of cultural 128 00:06:06,680 --> 00:06:04,440 and social lens that's really screwing 129 00:06:10,070 --> 00:06:06,690 up the objectivity of it right it's a 130 00:06:14,029 --> 00:06:10,080 sort of observer bias multiplied by a 131 00:06:17,769 --> 00:06:14,039 thousand and then you know a million as 132 00:06:21,019 --> 00:06:17,779 well what we ultimately have here is 133 00:06:22,640 --> 00:06:21,029 observation and experience versus a sort 134 00:06:25,040 --> 00:06:22,650 of cultural framework a cultural 135 00:06:30,469 --> 00:06:25,050 paradigm that that is occurring right 136 00:06:32,869 --> 00:06:30,479 you have all of these constructs merging 137 00:06:34,459 --> 00:06:32,879 you know my key example of this and I 138 00:06:36,649 --> 00:06:34,469 think that this is gonna upset a few 139 00:06:39,019 --> 00:06:36,659 people but um you know the idea of the 140 00:06:41,749 --> 00:06:39,029 Flying Saucer for example 141 00:06:43,429 --> 00:06:41,759 was totally an error you know to suggest 142 00:06:44,959 --> 00:06:43,439 that there's an objective reality and 143 00:06:47,809 --> 00:06:44,969 it's not being affected by our culture 144 00:06:50,299 --> 00:06:47,819 is ridiculous Kenneth Arnold in 1947 145 00:06:51,979 --> 00:06:50,309 when he had his UFO experience right he 146 00:06:54,769 --> 00:06:51,989 was flying over Mount Rainier in 147 00:06:55,759 --> 00:06:54,779 Washington and he saw nine objects I 148 00:06:58,519 --> 00:06:55,769 believe that were sort of 149 00:07:01,309 --> 00:06:58,529 crescent-shaped you know flying through 150 00:07:04,159 --> 00:07:01,319 the mountains at an incredible speed he 151 00:07:06,949 --> 00:07:04,169 he reports it and and a journalist on 152 00:07:09,589 --> 00:07:06,959 the ground makes an error right the 153 00:07:10,850 --> 00:07:09,599 journalist calls them flying saucers and 154 00:07:13,819 --> 00:07:10,860 in reality they weren't they were kind 155 00:07:15,829 --> 00:07:13,829 of more like flying bananas but you know 156 00:07:18,919 --> 00:07:15,839 Arnold describes him as they were you 157 00:07:20,059 --> 00:07:18,929 know like saucers skipping on water but 158 00:07:22,159 --> 00:07:20,069 the journalist refers them as flying 159 00:07:24,289 --> 00:07:22,169 saucers and you'll never guess what 160 00:07:27,649 --> 00:07:24,299 happened like you'll never you'll never 161 00:07:29,749 --> 00:07:27,659 imagine people started seeing not flying 162 00:07:32,419 --> 00:07:29,759 crescent-shaped objects they started 163 00:07:33,259 --> 00:07:32,429 seeing flying saucers all because of 164 00:07:36,139 --> 00:07:33,269 journalists 165 00:07:39,139 --> 00:07:36,149 you know screwed it up I mean this is a 166 00:07:41,089 --> 00:07:39,149 perfect example of how an objective 167 00:07:43,699 --> 00:07:41,099 experience let's say Kenneth Arnold 168 00:07:45,079 --> 00:07:43,709 sighting of an anomalous something 169 00:07:46,489 --> 00:07:45,089 rather could have been anything who 170 00:07:48,199 --> 00:07:46,499 knows could be birds for all we know but 171 00:07:50,719 --> 00:07:48,209 the point is he saw something that was 172 00:07:53,540 --> 00:07:50,729 anomalous and a journalist and a 173 00:07:56,269 --> 00:07:53,550 newspaper is what creates fundamentally 174 00:07:57,439 --> 00:07:56,279 the flying saucer phenomena people sort 175 00:07:58,489 --> 00:07:57,449 of seem discs everywhere 176 00:08:02,419 --> 00:07:58,499 and the big question need to ask 177 00:08:04,669 --> 00:08:02,429 yourself is one it was every single UFO 178 00:08:07,159 --> 00:08:04,679 sighting of a flying disc a complete 179 00:08:07,489 --> 00:08:07,169 hoax or a complete delusion of course 180 00:08:11,209 --> 00:08:07,499 not 181 00:08:15,589 --> 00:08:11,219 everyone in the world is a delusional or 182 00:08:18,799 --> 00:08:15,599 trying to hoax rather UFOs took on the 183 00:08:20,719 --> 00:08:18,809 cultural milieu of the day people think 184 00:08:22,819 --> 00:08:20,729 we look like flying saucers we're flying 185 00:08:24,439 --> 00:08:22,829 saucers now obviously that's a bit of a 186 00:08:26,719 --> 00:08:24,449 stretch I'm not saying us I was thinking 187 00:08:29,179 --> 00:08:26,729 like that but what you had was this 188 00:08:34,100 --> 00:08:29,189 objective observation people were making 189 00:08:36,799 --> 00:08:34,110 concerning flying saucers and the social 190 00:08:39,049 --> 00:08:36,809 cultural ideology of the flying saucer 191 00:08:39,499 --> 00:08:39,059 kind of manifesting itself as a flying 192 00:08:41,629 --> 00:08:39,509 saucer 193 00:08:43,639 --> 00:08:41,639 even though Arnold's sighting was not a 194 00:08:45,799 --> 00:08:43,649 flying saucer it's seemingly kind of 195 00:08:48,360 --> 00:08:45,809 ridiculous situation that's what it is 196 00:08:53,830 --> 00:08:48,370 so UFOs bring us 197 00:08:56,140 --> 00:08:53,840 into this kind of weird world weird you 198 00:09:01,980 --> 00:08:56,150 have this kind of weird in-between right 199 00:09:04,690 --> 00:09:01,990 this mixing of objective reality and 200 00:09:07,630 --> 00:09:04,700 cultural reality this is really where 201 00:09:09,970 --> 00:09:07,640 UFOs dwell this is really where the 202 00:09:12,640 --> 00:09:09,980 truth of the UFO phenomena exists in 203 00:09:15,520 --> 00:09:12,650 this weird kind of gap world in this 204 00:09:16,540 --> 00:09:15,530 in-between world this world of a fact 205 00:09:19,840 --> 00:09:16,550 and fiction 206 00:09:24,810 --> 00:09:19,850 um truth and mythology real and not real 207 00:09:28,030 --> 00:09:24,820 kind of merging together into one thing 208 00:09:29,770 --> 00:09:28,040 in my book I talk about Jacques Derrida 209 00:09:31,870 --> 00:09:29,780 is a French philosopher and he came up 210 00:09:34,960 --> 00:09:31,880 with this notion of the specter or the 211 00:09:36,160 --> 00:09:34,970 ghost now in his work he's obviously not 212 00:09:40,330 --> 00:09:36,170 talk about UFOs he's not high mode 213 00:09:43,240 --> 00:09:40,340 ghosts he's talking about politics and 214 00:09:45,880 --> 00:09:43,250 the culture of the post Cold War Europe 215 00:09:47,680 --> 00:09:45,890 moot point what he comes up with is this 216 00:09:50,080 --> 00:09:47,690 idea that there are certain concepts 217 00:09:51,550 --> 00:09:50,090 that exist and there's their spectral 218 00:09:54,100 --> 00:09:51,560 their ghosts and what they are is 219 00:09:56,130 --> 00:09:54,110 they're ideas that exist in kind of two 220 00:09:57,940 --> 00:09:56,140 worlds right they're real and not real 221 00:10:00,310 --> 00:09:57,950 simultaneously now he was talking about 222 00:10:02,890 --> 00:10:00,320 communism in Europe but in the case of 223 00:10:05,770 --> 00:10:02,900 UFOs they fit you have this kind of 224 00:10:09,040 --> 00:10:05,780 interesting merger of something real 225 00:10:11,470 --> 00:10:09,050 occurring real events anomalous events 226 00:10:16,240 --> 00:10:11,480 though they may be but real merging with 227 00:10:18,430 --> 00:10:16,250 odd cultural social media influenced 228 00:10:20,860 --> 00:10:18,440 influenced by cult leaders and 229 00:10:22,680 --> 00:10:20,870 conspiracy theorists and these two kind 230 00:10:26,740 --> 00:10:22,690 of concepts emerge into this unknown 231 00:10:28,610 --> 00:10:26,750 murky middle ground Middle Earth I get 232 00:10:31,140 --> 00:10:28,620 busted by 233 00:10:34,200 --> 00:10:31,150 copyright infringement the problem with 234 00:10:35,580 --> 00:10:34,210 existing in this kind of ghostly round 235 00:10:37,980 --> 00:10:35,590 in the middle between these two 236 00:10:42,150 --> 00:10:37,990 realities is really you get to this 237 00:10:44,010 --> 00:10:42,160 place of undef initial you cannot define 238 00:10:46,920 --> 00:10:44,020 what a UFO is anymore 239 00:10:49,260 --> 00:10:46,930 not in any real objective sense not in 240 00:10:51,330 --> 00:10:49,270 any real sense that will actually lead 241 00:10:53,190 --> 00:10:51,340 you to a solution to the problem and the 242 00:10:55,320 --> 00:10:53,200 only reason for that is because every 243 00:10:57,810 --> 00:10:55,330 time we try to define what a UFO is 244 00:11:00,270 --> 00:10:57,820 we're adding more layers to what UFOs 245 00:11:03,210 --> 00:11:00,280 actually are right so when I start 246 00:11:06,180 --> 00:11:03,220 thinking about UFOs I don't think about 247 00:11:08,910 --> 00:11:06,190 them from some objective over like 248 00:11:11,490 --> 00:11:08,920 reaching place from nowhere right I have 249 00:11:14,310 --> 00:11:11,500 to think about UFOs from my cultural 250 00:11:17,220 --> 00:11:14,320 place I can't suddenly walk out of my 251 00:11:18,780 --> 00:11:17,230 social world and say well I'm gonna look 252 00:11:20,220 --> 00:11:18,790 at the world objectively don't be 253 00:11:22,470 --> 00:11:20,230 ridiculous that's impossible 254 00:11:24,660 --> 00:11:22,480 none of us can do that no one can view 255 00:11:26,550 --> 00:11:24,670 their own reality outside of their own 256 00:11:29,220 --> 00:11:26,560 reality nobody can view their own 257 00:11:30,990 --> 00:11:29,230 culture their own ideas outside of that 258 00:11:32,430 --> 00:11:31,000 right there's no there's no really 259 00:11:34,350 --> 00:11:32,440 there's not really a such thing it's an 260 00:11:35,730 --> 00:11:34,360 objective thinking right we're all stuck 261 00:11:39,740 --> 00:11:35,740 within our culture we're all stuck 262 00:11:42,600 --> 00:11:39,750 within this little entrenched social 263 00:11:44,670 --> 00:11:42,610 world we've grown up in right you are 264 00:11:46,230 --> 00:11:44,680 governed by the experiences you've had 265 00:11:47,880 --> 00:11:46,240 you've ER you're governed by your 266 00:11:49,140 --> 00:11:47,890 education you're governed by what your 267 00:11:50,460 --> 00:11:49,150 parents taught you what your teachers 268 00:11:53,850 --> 00:11:50,470 taught you what your friends taught you 269 00:11:56,430 --> 00:11:53,860 you're governed by all that stuff so the 270 00:11:58,980 --> 00:11:56,440 inherent issue with UFOs is as people 271 00:12:02,700 --> 00:11:58,990 who study UFOs we are inherently stuck 272 00:12:04,080 --> 00:12:02,710 within our cultural world and we're 273 00:12:05,730 --> 00:12:04,090 trying to define something objective 274 00:12:07,860 --> 00:12:05,740 we're trying to come to a conclusion 275 00:12:10,470 --> 00:12:07,870 about something one that doesn't follow 276 00:12:14,400 --> 00:12:10,480 any rules and two is really only 277 00:12:16,200 --> 00:12:14,410 observed by people who also are in their 278 00:12:17,930 --> 00:12:16,210 own little cultural holds right so 279 00:12:20,280 --> 00:12:17,940 that's gonna muddy the water even more 280 00:12:22,500 --> 00:12:20,290 you know we're trying to perceive 281 00:12:23,970 --> 00:12:22,510 something come up with in a solution 282 00:12:25,180 --> 00:12:23,980 something come up with an answer about 283 00:12:27,369 --> 00:12:25,190 something 284 00:12:28,780 --> 00:12:27,379 but we're inherently trapped right we're 285 00:12:32,680 --> 00:12:28,790 in herre trapped in our own little 286 00:12:34,210 --> 00:12:32,690 cultural existence so how can we come to 287 00:12:36,610 --> 00:12:34,220 an objective conclusion concerning 288 00:12:38,920 --> 00:12:36,620 something like UFOs that already exist 289 00:12:41,050 --> 00:12:38,930 in this weird duality between fact and 290 00:12:43,410 --> 00:12:41,060 fiction that exists in is weird duality 291 00:12:46,420 --> 00:12:43,420 between objective experience and 292 00:12:48,100 --> 00:12:46,430 cultural experience on top of that we're 293 00:12:49,749 --> 00:12:48,110 adding our own cultural interpretations 294 00:12:51,699 --> 00:12:49,759 upon our sightings and upon our 295 00:12:53,769 --> 00:12:51,709 experiences and know that the people 296 00:12:56,579 --> 00:12:53,779 doing the research the investigation the 297 00:12:59,499 --> 00:12:56,589 the ufologist is also adding their own 298 00:13:02,800 --> 00:12:59,509 cultural and social interpretations into 299 00:13:03,900 --> 00:13:02,810 the mix we are fundamentally in you know 300 00:13:07,869 --> 00:13:03,910 [Music] 301 00:13:10,210 --> 00:13:07,879 freaking gongshow man a chaotic nonsense 302 00:13:11,110 --> 00:13:10,220 in regards to UFOs right what can we do 303 00:13:13,449 --> 00:13:11,120 with that information 304 00:13:15,639 --> 00:13:13,459 where can we begin ultimately the more 305 00:13:17,740 --> 00:13:15,649 explanation we try to add to UFOs but 306 00:13:20,439 --> 00:13:17,750 ultimately the more we try to define 307 00:13:22,090 --> 00:13:20,449 UFOs the more definitions we're putting 308 00:13:24,610 --> 00:13:22,100 in place the more filters we're creating 309 00:13:27,340 --> 00:13:24,620 for ourselves the more more more kind of 310 00:13:30,220 --> 00:13:27,350 ideas were jamming in down the UFO 311 00:13:32,860 --> 00:13:30,230 throat you know in effect we constantly 312 00:13:35,590 --> 00:13:32,870 create more ideologies we continue 313 00:13:37,210 --> 00:13:35,600 adding ideological paradigms on top of 314 00:13:42,699 --> 00:13:37,220 it over and over and over again I mean 315 00:13:45,009 --> 00:13:42,709 again this is evidence just to cite this 316 00:13:47,949 --> 00:13:45,019 here I mean it's obvious look at what 317 00:13:49,929 --> 00:13:47,959 people thought UFOs were in the 1940s 318 00:13:52,629 --> 00:13:49,939 and 50s and 60s they were clearly 319 00:13:55,120 --> 00:13:52,639 riveted together machines from spacemen 320 00:13:57,429 --> 00:13:55,130 from Venus and Mars and they looked like 321 00:14:00,460 --> 00:13:57,439 us and and they would deliver messages 322 00:14:02,110 --> 00:14:00,470 about oh you know you guys have the 323 00:14:03,850 --> 00:14:02,120 nuclear bomb and you should stop 324 00:14:06,280 --> 00:14:03,860 fighting with Russia because the 325 00:14:08,350 --> 00:14:06,290 intergalactic Federation is getting 326 00:14:10,389 --> 00:14:08,360 upset and we're nervous about you humans 327 00:14:11,710 --> 00:14:10,399 but don't worry we're all friendly and 328 00:14:13,059 --> 00:14:11,720 we're here to help you and and we're 329 00:14:15,040 --> 00:14:13,069 gonna save you and then you had this 330 00:14:17,980 --> 00:14:15,050 whole space brother movement and really 331 00:14:20,079 --> 00:14:17,990 like it was it was based upon ideas that 332 00:14:23,079 --> 00:14:20,089 were popular in the 1950s and 60s it was 333 00:14:25,840 --> 00:14:23,089 based upon that cultural framework of 334 00:14:28,090 --> 00:14:25,850 what technology could have been now look 335 00:14:30,490 --> 00:14:28,100 at you follow gee today go on UFO 336 00:14:31,749 --> 00:14:30,500 Twitter hashtag UFO Twitter go on UFO 337 00:14:33,429 --> 00:14:31,759 Twitter and look at what people are 338 00:14:35,259 --> 00:14:33,439 talking about quantum mechanics and 339 00:14:37,900 --> 00:14:35,269 quantum physics and the aliens must be 340 00:14:39,640 --> 00:14:37,910 using some sort of quantum system to 341 00:14:41,200 --> 00:14:39,650 travel around and you know you have 342 00:14:43,060 --> 00:14:41,210 stuff about consciousness and you have 343 00:14:45,460 --> 00:14:43,070 stuff all these new-age ideas I mean 344 00:14:47,890 --> 00:14:45,470 it's just mimicking exactly what our 345 00:14:49,930 --> 00:14:47,900 society is it's ridiculous 346 00:14:52,570 --> 00:14:49,940 today in the 21st century to think that 347 00:14:55,030 --> 00:14:52,580 UFOs come from Mars and they come from 348 00:14:57,280 --> 00:14:55,040 Venus it's ridiculous we know now enough 349 00:14:59,860 --> 00:14:57,290 about Mars and Venus to be able to 350 00:15:03,250 --> 00:14:59,870 assure people and we just know in 351 00:15:04,660 --> 00:15:03,260 general there's no UFOs from Venus and 352 00:15:05,890 --> 00:15:04,670 Mars and they're certainly not space 353 00:15:07,660 --> 00:15:05,900 brothers and they certainly don't have 354 00:15:08,230 --> 00:15:07,670 some sort of intergalactic Federation of 355 00:15:10,530 --> 00:15:08,240 Planets 356 00:15:14,560 --> 00:15:10,540 that's from Star Trek so as we change 357 00:15:17,140 --> 00:15:14,570 UFOs change with us as we change the 358 00:15:19,330 --> 00:15:17,150 entire framework of ufology changes 359 00:15:20,980 --> 00:15:19,340 alongside us it's not that ufology is 360 00:15:24,310 --> 00:15:20,990 getting better answers it's not that 361 00:15:25,900 --> 00:15:24,320 ufology is on to something rather it's 362 00:15:28,570 --> 00:15:25,910 less on to it than it's ever been 363 00:15:30,880 --> 00:15:28,580 we're getting further away as time moves 364 00:15:33,400 --> 00:15:30,890 on as we continue to study UFOs as we 365 00:15:35,440 --> 00:15:33,410 continue to get into UFOs as we continue 366 00:15:37,690 --> 00:15:35,450 to engage with the subject matter as we 367 00:15:40,030 --> 00:15:37,700 continue to try and define what UFOs are 368 00:15:42,220 --> 00:15:40,040 we're simply adding more to the mystery 369 00:15:44,020 --> 00:15:42,230 but this is maybe the beauty of ufology 370 00:15:46,420 --> 00:15:44,030 and the beauty of UFOs right everyone 371 00:15:48,640 --> 00:15:46,430 loves a good mystery every once in a 372 00:15:49,150 --> 00:15:48,650 while and ufology man don't get me 373 00:15:51,550 --> 00:15:49,160 started 374 00:15:53,260 --> 00:15:51,560 UFOs is basically the mystery novel that 375 00:15:56,710 --> 00:15:53,270 really never ends I mean it's 376 00:15:58,870 --> 00:15:56,720 fundamentally this this it's constant 377 00:16:01,780 --> 00:15:58,880 search and I think that that's why it's 378 00:16:04,300 --> 00:16:01,790 compelling right we like the idea of 379 00:16:07,450 --> 00:16:04,310 searching all the time we like the idea 380 00:16:09,970 --> 00:16:07,460 of mysteries we like the idea of not 381 00:16:11,650 --> 00:16:09,980 knowing where something is or are or not 382 00:16:13,060 --> 00:16:11,660 knowing what's over the hill or are 383 00:16:15,490 --> 00:16:13,070 around the next bend and trying to 384 00:16:18,760 --> 00:16:15,500 figure it out we're excellent 385 00:16:23,800 --> 00:16:18,770 mythologize errs I'm why is there a 386 00:16:30,630 --> 00:16:28,220 [Music] 387 00:16:32,040 --> 00:16:30,640 it's like signs all up in here so where 388 00:16:34,050 --> 00:16:32,050 does this fundamentally leave us right 389 00:16:36,360 --> 00:16:34,060 like where are we left then you falah 390 00:16:38,880 --> 00:16:36,370 giclees speaking pissed off that's the 391 00:16:40,800 --> 00:16:38,890 first thing because listen I hate to 392 00:16:43,550 --> 00:16:40,810 burst your youthful logical bubbles I 393 00:16:46,440 --> 00:16:43,560 can just see the thumbs down there 394 00:16:48,870 --> 00:16:46,450 listen you know where does this leave us 395 00:16:51,840 --> 00:16:48,880 what can we fundamentally do what can we 396 00:16:55,020 --> 00:16:51,850 fundamentally study is is trying to 397 00:17:00,000 --> 00:16:55,030 ascertain the science here really the 398 00:17:01,020 --> 00:17:00,010 answer you know you know I don't know 399 00:17:02,700 --> 00:17:01,030 because we just don't have enough 400 00:17:06,000 --> 00:17:02,710 answers we don't have enough observable 401 00:17:08,100 --> 00:17:06,010 data from UFOs to come to any conclusion 402 00:17:09,990 --> 00:17:08,110 not only that the damn things keep 403 00:17:12,720 --> 00:17:10,000 changing you know in the 1950s and 60s 404 00:17:15,810 --> 00:17:12,730 UFOs acted and looked and worked very 405 00:17:17,910 --> 00:17:15,820 differently than they do today they had 406 00:17:20,430 --> 00:17:17,920 the landing gear and ladders little 407 00:17:21,840 --> 00:17:20,440 people would get out of the like maybe 408 00:17:23,670 --> 00:17:21,850 they'd crawl down there little ladders 409 00:17:25,500 --> 00:17:23,680 and they would collect like soil samples 410 00:17:27,090 --> 00:17:25,510 and infauna samples and floor samples 411 00:17:28,860 --> 00:17:27,100 like you know they'd steal squirrel or 412 00:17:30,090 --> 00:17:28,870 something and then they would see human 413 00:17:32,820 --> 00:17:30,100 and black and they'd jump back in the 414 00:17:34,290 --> 00:17:32,830 ship and then fly off I mean if that 415 00:17:36,300 --> 00:17:34,300 happened today I mean good lord that's 416 00:17:38,100 --> 00:17:36,310 ridiculous you know UFO sightings today 417 00:17:39,750 --> 00:17:38,110 are very different so does you know we 418 00:17:41,700 --> 00:17:39,760 have to kind of start to question you 419 00:17:43,920 --> 00:17:41,710 know the sightings that people are 420 00:17:46,050 --> 00:17:43,930 having that objective reality how much 421 00:17:48,360 --> 00:17:46,060 of it is really merging with the social 422 00:17:50,610 --> 00:17:48,370 reality so where are we left if UFOs 423 00:17:52,740 --> 00:17:50,620 aren't some stable idea we can study 424 00:17:54,990 --> 00:17:52,750 they're not a stable concept we can 425 00:17:57,030 --> 00:17:55,000 study they're not a stable construct we 426 00:17:58,800 --> 00:17:57,040 can study we have no idea what they are 427 00:18:00,360 --> 00:17:58,810 we have no idea when they'll show up 428 00:18:04,460 --> 00:18:00,370 they're not repeatable there's no 429 00:18:06,150 --> 00:18:04,470 evidence really to to to engage with 430 00:18:09,030 --> 00:18:06,160 where we left 431 00:18:11,900 --> 00:18:09,040 what is ufology to do you know it 432 00:18:14,250 --> 00:18:11,910 becomes a game of culture we're left to 433 00:18:16,410 --> 00:18:14,260 be able to really fundamentally look at 434 00:18:19,170 --> 00:18:16,420 people at this point we can look at the 435 00:18:21,240 --> 00:18:19,180 cultural ideas that frame up ufology we 436 00:18:23,370 --> 00:18:21,250 can look at the social constructs the 437 00:18:25,680 --> 00:18:23,380 the cultural baggage we all have the 438 00:18:28,410 --> 00:18:25,690 experiences we all have the way our 439 00:18:30,180 --> 00:18:28,420 society perceives its own reality that's 440 00:18:32,520 --> 00:18:30,190 really where you follow she ought to be 441 00:18:34,330 --> 00:18:32,530 heading it should be a cultural game it 442 00:18:36,970 --> 00:18:34,340 should be exploring the 443 00:18:39,190 --> 00:18:36,980 the cultural phenomena of UFOs and less 444 00:18:43,419 --> 00:18:39,200 the scientific one we ultimately need to 445 00:18:46,600 --> 00:18:43,429 deconstruct the cultural concepts that 446 00:18:48,519 --> 00:18:46,610 frame up kind of this UFO reality the 447 00:18:50,200 --> 00:18:48,529 inherent problem to this is every time 448 00:18:52,899 --> 00:18:50,210 we attempt to deconstruct anything 449 00:18:54,940 --> 00:18:52,909 anytime we at any time we try to get to 450 00:18:56,860 --> 00:18:54,950 the root of what's going on we obviously 451 00:18:58,630 --> 00:18:56,870 need to understand we're adding more 452 00:19:00,460 --> 00:18:58,640 layers to the construction this is 453 00:19:02,590 --> 00:19:00,470 ultimately what dari da points out when 454 00:19:05,140 --> 00:19:02,600 it comes to deconstruction whenever you 455 00:19:07,480 --> 00:19:05,150 try to understand something better 456 00:19:09,399 --> 00:19:07,490 whenever you try to define something 457 00:19:11,860 --> 00:19:09,409 whenever you try to give it an 458 00:19:15,130 --> 00:19:11,870 explanation and whenever you add more 459 00:19:16,450 --> 00:19:15,140 information to the idea you are building 460 00:19:18,909 --> 00:19:16,460 more layers up you're adding more 461 00:19:22,269 --> 00:19:18,919 filters to that concept you ultimately 462 00:19:24,370 --> 00:19:22,279 get bogged down by the deconstruction 463 00:19:26,860 --> 00:19:24,380 itself so this needs to kind of get all 464 00:19:31,269 --> 00:19:26,870 boiled down now to my big thesis here 465 00:19:33,070 --> 00:19:31,279 which is why are UFOs countercultural it 466 00:19:37,000 --> 00:19:33,080 really kind of comes down to something 467 00:19:39,639 --> 00:19:37,010 simple you know UFOs are taboo in polite 468 00:19:41,799 --> 00:19:39,649 society and in sort of elite society and 469 00:19:44,049 --> 00:19:41,809 in scientific and academic societies 470 00:19:48,909 --> 00:19:44,059 right especially by more conservative 471 00:19:52,260 --> 00:19:48,919 thinkers UFOs are taboo because I think 472 00:19:54,669 --> 00:19:52,270 they bring out the fundamental flaw that 473 00:19:56,950 --> 00:19:54,679 you know we need to kind of see that 474 00:19:59,710 --> 00:19:56,960 that's right in front of us we've we've 475 00:20:01,899 --> 00:19:59,720 we've created for ourselves in sort of 476 00:20:03,549 --> 00:20:01,909 the 20th and 21st centuries and even 477 00:20:05,590 --> 00:20:03,559 earlier but in the 20 to 21st centuries 478 00:20:09,970 --> 00:20:05,600 for sure this notion that science and 479 00:20:12,310 --> 00:20:09,980 technology empiricism is is really the 480 00:20:14,740 --> 00:20:12,320 the be-all and end-all of knowledge and 481 00:20:17,139 --> 00:20:14,750 the beauty of empirical thinking the 482 00:20:20,320 --> 00:20:17,149 beauty of scientific method the beauty 483 00:20:23,640 --> 00:20:20,330 of an academia of an ivory tower of 484 00:20:27,870 --> 00:20:23,650 structures of elite knowledge 485 00:20:30,390 --> 00:20:27,880 is they require kind of one key notion 486 00:20:32,540 --> 00:20:30,400 that humans themselves and human 487 00:20:37,010 --> 00:20:32,550 thinking is the highest point of 488 00:20:39,540 --> 00:20:37,020 civilization in society and the cosmos 489 00:20:42,150 --> 00:20:39,550 empiricism itself the scientific method 490 00:20:45,360 --> 00:20:42,160 itself all all scientific thinking 491 00:20:48,090 --> 00:20:45,370 hinges upon the notion that humans are 492 00:20:51,060 --> 00:20:48,100 able to understand the universe and 493 00:20:54,720 --> 00:20:51,070 everything around us we govern reality 494 00:20:58,169 --> 00:20:54,730 we shape our own destiny we are the 495 00:21:01,980 --> 00:20:58,179 arbiters of knowledge we as a group as a 496 00:21:04,910 --> 00:21:01,990 species under the guise of empiricism 497 00:21:09,270 --> 00:21:04,920 are the way the truth and the light and 498 00:21:11,520 --> 00:21:09,280 fundamentally what ufos do is they call 499 00:21:13,860 --> 00:21:11,530 that all into question they challenge 500 00:21:17,220 --> 00:21:13,870 this fundamental thinking they challenge 501 00:21:20,220 --> 00:21:17,230 this notion that empiricism has and will 502 00:21:22,140 --> 00:21:20,230 have all the answers we've chosen to 503 00:21:23,580 --> 00:21:22,150 live our lives as a society upon this 504 00:21:25,590 --> 00:21:23,590 notion that humans are here to write 505 00:21:27,090 --> 00:21:25,600 we're the top of the food chain you know 506 00:21:30,360 --> 00:21:27,100 the technical term for this is an 507 00:21:34,049 --> 00:21:30,370 through anthropocentrism right we are 508 00:21:36,150 --> 00:21:34,059 the center of knowledge and truth we are 509 00:21:38,100 --> 00:21:36,160 the center of some of the universe in a 510 00:21:40,950 --> 00:21:38,110 sense and all knowledge kind of revolves 511 00:21:43,020 --> 00:21:40,960 around us and as we develop more science 512 00:21:44,850 --> 00:21:43,030 better science as we develop technology 513 00:21:47,220 --> 00:21:44,860 and better technology we can start 514 00:21:49,470 --> 00:21:47,230 yanking that knowledge towards us like a 515 00:21:51,270 --> 00:21:49,480 big gravitational field and and we can 516 00:21:52,380 --> 00:21:51,280 kind of consume it understand it and 517 00:21:54,630 --> 00:21:52,390 there we go there's another kind of 518 00:21:57,660 --> 00:21:54,640 piece of the puzzle and you know 519 00:21:59,370 --> 00:21:57,670 following a very Aristotelian model we 520 00:22:01,530 --> 00:21:59,380 can ultimately understand the entire 521 00:22:03,660 --> 00:22:01,540 universe nothing can stand in the way of 522 00:22:05,940 --> 00:22:03,670 us 523 00:22:08,640 --> 00:22:05,950 you know UFOs though kind of question 524 00:22:10,770 --> 00:22:08,650 this notion right UFOs constantly change 525 00:22:12,060 --> 00:22:10,780 with the times they're constantly just a 526 00:22:15,000 --> 00:22:12,070 little bit out of reach they're 527 00:22:17,730 --> 00:22:15,010 constantly just around the bend and over 528 00:22:21,170 --> 00:22:17,740 the hill and as we get closer they move 529 00:22:24,720 --> 00:22:21,180 further away you know UFOs are not 530 00:22:27,450 --> 00:22:24,730 following how empirical evidence and 531 00:22:29,700 --> 00:22:27,460 scientific method you know it dictates 532 00:22:32,250 --> 00:22:29,710 the universe ought to work UFOs prove 533 00:22:34,980 --> 00:22:32,260 fundamentally that empiricism is not the 534 00:22:36,960 --> 00:22:34,990 the only arbiter of knowledge it goes to 535 00:22:37,560 --> 00:22:36,970 show that empiricism scientific method 536 00:22:39,270 --> 00:22:37,570 all that stuff 537 00:22:40,800 --> 00:22:39,280 wild great like don't get me wrong I'm a 538 00:22:42,450 --> 00:22:40,810 huge fan of science I'm a huge fan of 539 00:22:45,330 --> 00:22:42,460 the scientific method like listen 540 00:22:49,080 --> 00:22:45,340 youthful oddly speaking I'm a skeptic 541 00:22:53,460 --> 00:22:49,090 like bad you know ultimately we're kind 542 00:22:55,620 --> 00:22:53,470 of in this worldview that were trapped 543 00:22:58,890 --> 00:22:55,630 in of empiricism of anthropocentrism 544 00:23:02,040 --> 00:22:58,900 this notion that we can achieve anything 545 00:23:04,620 --> 00:23:02,050 through knowledge and it just might not 546 00:23:06,750 --> 00:23:04,630 be the case all right and that's why 547 00:23:08,370 --> 00:23:06,760 ufos piss people off that's why ufos 548 00:23:10,080 --> 00:23:08,380 piss off scientists and they piss off 549 00:23:12,930 --> 00:23:10,090 academics especially conservative ones 550 00:23:15,180 --> 00:23:12,940 they piss off people who exist in this 551 00:23:16,620 --> 00:23:15,190 sort of elite state who have basically 552 00:23:18,090 --> 00:23:16,630 built their entire lives and their 553 00:23:20,910 --> 00:23:18,100 foundation upon the knowledge that 554 00:23:23,400 --> 00:23:20,920 everything is possible that that all if 555 00:23:26,550 --> 00:23:23,410 we if we apply enough empirical thinking 556 00:23:29,010 --> 00:23:26,560 to something we can reach it ufos call 557 00:23:31,500 --> 00:23:29,020 that all into question ufos bring that 558 00:23:34,740 --> 00:23:31,510 house of cards tumbling down 559 00:23:37,050 --> 00:23:34,750 and we're left and we're stuck we kind 560 00:23:40,680 --> 00:23:37,060 of are left to wallow now in this weird 561 00:23:43,950 --> 00:23:40,690 place of ambiguity we don't know what 562 00:23:46,320 --> 00:23:43,960 reality is that we don't know what is 563 00:23:48,840 --> 00:23:46,330 the real path to knowledge there might 564 00:23:50,660 --> 00:23:48,850 not be one you know fundamentally it 565 00:23:54,330 --> 00:23:50,670 could be a whole mix of things as well 566 00:23:58,260 --> 00:23:54,340 who the hell knows man so we need to 567 00:24:02,340 --> 00:23:58,270 engage in you Falah djegal discourse 568 00:24:04,560 --> 00:24:02,350 that deals more by calling these 569 00:24:07,050 --> 00:24:04,570 concepts into questions that engages 570 00:24:09,159 --> 00:24:07,060 with the cultural aspects of ufology i 571 00:24:12,320 --> 00:24:09,169 mean 572 00:24:14,479 --> 00:24:12,330 it doesn't matter how much truth we we 573 00:24:16,369 --> 00:24:14,489 get - how much truth we try and get - 574 00:24:18,919 --> 00:24:16,379 we're dealing with a mythological 575 00:24:20,479 --> 00:24:18,929 question here I think we need to start 576 00:24:21,950 --> 00:24:20,489 looking at the reasons of why it's 577 00:24:23,690 --> 00:24:21,960 mythological when you start looking at 578 00:24:25,399 --> 00:24:23,700 the mythology itself and the people who 579 00:24:27,349 --> 00:24:25,409 generate those mythologies and why they 580 00:24:31,129 --> 00:24:27,359 generate those pathologies we're engaged 581 00:24:34,129 --> 00:24:31,139 in a study of something that by its very 582 00:24:35,599 --> 00:24:34,139 nature has to remain unknown thanks very 583 00:24:37,940 --> 00:24:35,609 much for watching I really appreciate 584 00:24:39,769 --> 00:24:37,950 you taking the time and hang out with me 585 00:24:42,889 --> 00:24:39,779 in the forest if you want to find my 586 00:24:44,599 --> 00:24:42,899 work if you want to keep tabs on me you 587 00:24:48,049 --> 00:24:44,609 can do it via social media or you can go 588 00:24:50,810 --> 00:24:48,059 to my web sites of wwm Jaber nice calm 589 00:24:53,529 --> 00:24:50,820 or you can follow me on twitter at MJ 590 00:24:55,759 --> 00:24:53,539 benaiah shoot me a DM shoot me an email 591 00:24:59,840 --> 00:24:55,769 call me on my phone if you have my phone 592 00:25:02,359 --> 00:24:59,850 number I hope you don't and listen stay 593 00:25:06,460 --> 00:25:02,369 safe I love you all have a happy